Moral Luck

11 January 2014

Suppose Ken and I buy tickets for the California Lottery. We go to the same 7-11, pay the same amount, push the same button to get a ticket with randomly generated numbers. Ken, lucky fellow, plays the winning number and collect $10 million. (This is a fictional example!). I play a losing number, and get nothing.

That’s a pretty good example of luck. Ken was lucky, I wasn’t. Suppose I argue that the result --- Ken with his $10 million, me with nothing --- is unfair. After all, we paid the same amount, put the same amount of thought into choosing numbers (none), had the same good intentions about how we would spend the money, and had about the same need for $10 million (none). So it’s unfair that he gets all that money, and I get nothing. Ideservethe prize as much as he does.

你不会觉得这个论点令人印象深刻。我想要什么?彩票头奖应该在购票者中平均分配?那就不是彩票了,对吧?即使你称之为彩票,谁会去玩呢?花一美元买一张票,然后用不到一美元的钱(支付费用)回来。彩票的整体理念是获得你不应该比其他人拥有更多的头奖——幸运。

道德似乎是另一回事。在一个公平的道德体系中,似乎一个人如何被对待——一个人如何得到赞扬和指责,惩罚和奖励----无论是由国家,其他人,或自己,应该取决于一个人应该得到什么。一个人应该得到什么取决于他自己的意图,欲望,动机等等;这不应该是运气的问题。

But consider this example. Doctors A and B both perform operations, using general anesthesia. Both A and B are negligent, in not checking whether their patients have epilepsy --- an important thing to do, with general anesthesia, although of course most people don’t have epilepsy. Dr. A is lucky. His patient doesn’t have epilepsy, and does fine. Dr. B is unlucky. His patient has epilepsy, and has a seizure and dies.

Both doctors were negligent. And we can assume they both had good intentions and were equally skillful. The difference was luck. So, given what we said a moment ago, they seem to be the same in terms of what they deserve. But we certainly wouldn’t treat them the same. Dr. B will may be guilty of medical manslaughter, or at least malpractice. They probably won’t even treat themselves the same. Dr. B is likely to feel guilty, and perhaps be haunted by what he has done. If Dr. A hears about what happened with Dr. B’s operation, and realizes that he himself was similarly negligent, is likely to feel some guilt, but not bewith guilt, as might be appropriate for B.

So, what should we say?

  • The doctors do differ morally, not because of difference intention, but because of lucky and lucky circumstances, and this justified the difference in treatment?
  • 医生们在道德上没有区别,对待上的差别是不公平和不必要的吗?
  • The doctors do not differ morally, but the difference in treatment makes a lot of sense.

我选择第三个选项。这样想吧。加州政府想让我们去买加州彩票。赢家身上堆积的财富越多,想玩的人就会越多。因此,区别对待理应得到同等待遇的彩票玩家是有道理的。

The state of California does not want doctors to play the Negligence Lottery. Each negligent doctor (or driver, etc.) wins if nothing bad happens, loses if it does. The dreadful result of being a loser, provides an incentive doctors not to play the game at all --- i.e. not to be negligent. If the costs and punishments for the occasional bad results were distributed equally across all the players --- all the negligent doctors --- that might be fair, but there would be little negative incentive for playing the game. But piling on the penalties on those who lose the lottery --- those whose negligence leads to disaster --- the state strives to run a lottery that no doctor will want to enter.

Comments(15)


Mello Jello's picture

Mello Jello

Saturday, January 11, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

-- I'm going to call a

——我将称之为斯特劳曼逻辑谬误:医生的反应是基于感知到的常态,不公正地补充了论点的完整性。
-- The inclusion of "luck" into the argument is risky. It's quite vulgar in the post-modern age to lay causality at the feet of Fortuna. Luck is a vulgar imposition of order that distorts anything nearing truthful causality.
——我将把提供的子弹称为“错误困境”;您没有根据您所提供的选项提供最完整的选项集;我并不是要求实现每一种可能,只是要求“做不同”和“不不同”以更符合逻辑的形式被更整齐地划分。
.
Ultimately the idea is great but not proven here: you cannot reasonably compare 1.) the causality leading up to the morality surrounding the prosecution of a doctor regarding negligence in surgery resulting in death to 2.) the inverted causality of winning the lottery. 1 and 2 are apples and oranges.

Harold G. Neuman's picture

Harold G. Neuman

Sunday, January 12, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

I suppose there may be some

我想运气和道德之间可能有某种联系,然而,我还不能评估到底是什么联系。这可能大致符合上述评论由Mello Jello。例如,如果道德具有一些普遍的参数,那么它似乎就不依赖于掷骰子、轮盘赌的旋转或抽牌。当然,有一些概率论理论家可能会在一个或另一个层面上对此提出异议。人们一直在以各种方式争论进化论已被证实的事实,就像他们争论科学与宗教。总会有不同意见。这就是现实。和意识。

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, January 13, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

John, this is a very

John, this is a very difficult concept to understand, but maybe you could have put in some general definitions or better yet a general question. I think Harold and Mello are completely missing the point, because, i think, in part, the fact that you just gave examples (which seems strange since examples are such a good way to explain things.) The point is:
有利/不利的环境似乎是存在的。如果这是运气,那么运气是存在的。
*我们不应该因为我们无法控制的事情(即环境)而受到责备或赞扬。This is called the 'control principle'
* Now the question is: 'Can the same moral judgments apply when what we are assessed for is largely beyond our control?'
* What makes this tricky is, in part, the term 'Moral Luck". Moral luck occurs when you CAN be assessed for these factors that are not under your control, so the term almost runs counter to our intuitions (e.g. the control principle).
Mello and Harold seem to be surprised that luck has *anything* to do with morality assessments even in principle. The very fact that they think this way, suggests to me that they don't understand the concepts. Of course luck (circumstance) plays SOME role in moral considerations. This is why we make a distinction between manslaughter and murder.
But, as you describe, this isn't even the main issue surrounding Moral Luck. The issue isn't whether luck plays any role in moral assessments (it does), it's whether people can be morally judged when luck *is the determining (or major) factor*.
I think the comments so far belie the deep debate and important considerations of Moral Luck. This isn't a strawman or a false dilemma, this is something that people have been thinking about for centuries. As evidence, maybe you should link to SEP:
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/moral-luck/

Harold G. Neuman's picture

Harold G. Neuman

Monday, January 13, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

I guess I just don't see the

我想我只是看不出运气和环境之间的关系。我认为,运气是不可控的,而环境在某种程度上取决于我们的选择。如果我选择追逐并攻击一个因为我在交通中没有让开而向我敬礼的人,我就根据环境制造了一个问题。最终发生的事情只取决于运气,因为我或他可能会遭受痛苦或死亡,因为我基于环境的选择。如果没有记错的话,过失杀人和谋杀是法律上的区别,通常是由接受司法建议的陪审团来决定的。这样的结果是根据特定的法律规则产生的,还有辩诉交易——尽管是真理和正义。柏拉图等人在他们的时代是伟大的。现在,也许不是这么回事。哲学家们小心!

Thinker_Extraordinaire's picture

Thinker_Extraor...

Wednesday, January 15, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

I would choose option three

I would choose option three from a pure practical standpoint. It makes sense that not everyone can win the lottery -- nobody would play if it was so. Regarding the doctors' illustration, there would be no way to figure out who performed malpractice. Moreover, if that was a viable option, like you stated, there would be little disincentive to perform malpractice.
From a philosophical standpoint I would also choose option three. Every lottery player knows what they are getting into when they buy a ticket -- they have a small chance of winning. They also know the next person in line has the same chance of winning. That means there is nothing unfair about either situation; each participant in your illustrations has the same chance of the said result.

Mello Jello's picture

Mello Jello

Wednesday, January 15, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

You're absolutely right. I

You're absolutely right. I honestly felt overwhelmed by the argument and I wasn't sure if I should have even replied to it. But I did and it's blatantly obvious that I attacked the knot without the slightest idea of how to untie it. Next time I find myself in this position I will simply ask questions. I'm finding that sophistry is such an easy trap to fall into for beginners but I'm trying my hardest to be at least Socratic. The constructive criticism is much appreciated.

Clars's picture

Clars

Wednesday, January 15, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

"Moral"; to defer to

"Moral"; to defer to religious teachings...What are the creator's view of Moral Luck?
If someone accidently causes the death of another, the action was not intended to kill, but the consequence killed, the actor could flee to a city of refuge to escape judgment and punishment; therefore, intention matters. (Old Testement). If the lack of moral intention exists within a person which has them desire and intend to kill or commit other moral faults, they are as guilty as someone who has acted upon them... whether they acted or not; the character and intention matters.(New Testement- sermon on the mount, regarding adultery, lusting after a woman COMMITS adultery already within his heart).
Intention matters more than outcome.

Guest's picture

Guest

Thursday, January 16, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

It seems to me that you can't

It seems to me that you can't really compare the situations of doctors A and B. In reality many of the surrounding circumstances will be different. One of the doctors might know more about the patient than the other does, he might know enough that he can take a pretty good guess that the patient doesn't have epilepsy, or he might know how to solve any problems it might lead to during the operation, etc. And when you get to the human motivations of the doctor, the patient, and anyone else involved - maybe they like each other, maybe they don't, maybe the doctor's a Jew and the patient's a Nazi war criminal - that will throw in a wildcard or two. I think that this kind of comparison is just a philosophical abstraction. So all you can do is look at the outcomes. I think the law is right if it treats murder more seriously than attempted murder.

Harold G. Neuman's picture

Harold G. Neuman

Friday, January 17, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

I do not believe luck and

我不相信运气和环境是一样的。我对这种信仰并不感到“惊讶”,就像我不相信运气和道德之间的“任何”关系一样。正如我所坚持的,运气是不可预测的。这就是为什么我不玩彩票和老虎机的原因。环境至少在某种程度上是在我们的控制范围内的:不要在晚上穿着黑色衣服在街上散步或慢跑,同时用随身听听你最喜欢的《黑色安息日》(black Sabbath)的歌——或任何你可能已经获得的分散注意力的设备。希望这些插图能澄清我的信念——尽管我对此表示怀疑。在我所在的州和城市,慢跑者、步行者和骑自行车的人经常死亡,因为他们不相信他们应该自己照顾自己。这是一种遗憾,但它由于不负责任,或:情况;……不是运气。为什么人们很难理解呢? I AM surprised by stupidity---and baffled, in this age of reason and enlightenment. Or, it is?...hmmmmm.

dabrowsa@indiana.edu's picture

dabrowsa@indiana.edu

Sunday, January 19, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

There are at least 3

There are at least 3 different threads here: 1. moral, 2. psychological , 3. legal. Only the first is really the purview of philosophy. My take, which I think is common, is that luck should not affect morality but does in fact affect psychology. Assuming the latter is widely held, the legal realm should follow the psychological one or the laws will not be supported.

Guest's picture

Guest

Monday, January 20, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

Fortune

Fortune
Seneca created a Goddess for man to know
Equal are her gifts to all her show.
The beautiful Fortune with cornucopia in hand
As many treasures as grains of sand.
The other hand with ore she steers, any direction she please
不需要你我来指导,只有命运之神。
It is not her malice only our weak scale
当事情变得糟糕,毁掉生活的时候?年代的故事。
When she is good, who is to say
Millionaire or pauper has most time to play.
Fortune so busy with no space to run
会走路的人更健康。
She gives us a house to live and take care
The homeless a simple life of nature to share.
Love is from Fortune so powerfully sought
Sometime in our life it seems we have naught.
The power of love can never be lost
Nor be taken away at any cost
In love?s absence she continues to grow
Hearts strengthening aura glow.
Fortune?s gifts are only measure
Which is sad which is pleasure?
We can not judge Fortune?s good or bad
Only have thoughts some glad some sad.
Better to have then to not
Imagine to lose one?s whole lot.
And if we have not anything at all
Would one be happier to never worry of fall?
To have is to have whatever may be
生命是财富?S幸福的想法只有看得到。
The man who has seen both rich and poor
The gifts in Fortunes hand, all of her store.
Has the full life, will never long
Only to sing Fortune?s beautiful song.
Then nothing truly can be won or lost
Only flawed value need to be tossed.
If truth over material is all man sought
Seneca?s Fortune, is only a thought!
=

Harold G. Neuman's picture

Harold G. Neuman

Thursday, February 6, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

Let's start over and try to

Let's start over and try to simplify this apparently complex discussion. Firstly, might we define morality? Oh, no! This won't do will it? Because morality appears to be CULTURALLY connected---examples include the manner in which negroes were treated in early America, and the manner in which women are treated in India today. But wait. Moral issues depend on where one lives? Yes! Surprise! Morality IS a function of culture, practice and tradition. Ergo, if we aspire to change morality, we must, therefore,aspire to alter the culture(s) that offend our notions of what is properly moral. This has not worked much in my short lifetime. Nor did it work in the short lifetimes of my parents. Say What You Know. Share What You Have. Do What You Can...Notice, then, I have dwelled on morality, diverse though it may be. Morality is a function of cultural intractibility. It is where we are more than who we BELIEVE ourselves to be. How quaint.
现在,祝你好运:蛇眼,你输了;箱卡,你输了;玩彩票吗?——骰子游戏的赔率更好,短期内——但是,赌博没有道德可言。你可以去银行证明这一点。哈,哈。
If any of the above reminds you of history, it should. You have lived it; if you noticed. As to the gambling observations, those are merely peripheral facts. Good night.
Harold.
(I'll consult with anyone on matters of cultural intractibility and Historionic Effect, but my time is valuable, therefore(or ergo), expensive.)

Hugh Millar's picture

Hugh Millar

Friday, February 7, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

这是另一个视角。

这是另一个视角。公平是一种强大的人类直觉,有助于促进社会合作,但有时感觉不合适。一名医生在实施麻醉前不检查是否患有糖尿病,这不仅会危及病人的生命,还会危及他的工作。这是预付款协议,每个人都明白。如果他走了捷径并侥幸逃脱,那他就是幸运的,不会受到任何惩罚。如果病人癫痫发作而死亡,医生就有两方面的不幸,并承担后果。在股市上输掉10万美元可能会让一个人失去他的房子,而另一个人只能推迟购买他的新帆船。2022世界杯小组赛分组潜在损失的后果必须被考虑到做出游戏的决定中,这样就不会出现不公平的结果。
Hugh

Harold G. Neuman's picture

Harold G. Neuman

Friday, February 7, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

Well-stated, Hugh---well

Well-stated, Hugh---well-stated. I live as practically as possible. Sounds like you do too.
Newman.

Daniel Pech's picture

Daniel Pech

Sunday, March 2, 2014 -- 4:00 PM

"What one deserves should

"What one deserves should depend on one?s own intentions, desires, motivations and things like that; it shouldn?t be a matter of...x."
What one deserves, in terms of reward and burden, very much partly depends on the effects which one's actions have on others of equally well-intentioned moral standing. If my physiology needs the thermostat turned up and yours needs it turned down, we each could be wrong upon the other in our own good intention to 'make the world the right temperature'.